Excellent discusion. What surprises me with Weberman's victim and with Yehudis Goldsobel is that any girl above the age of 12 at the latest should be aware of Halachahs of Yichud and Negia. I also don't understand, perhaps because I'm a male, how could young girls be suffering abuse for years and not talk to their mothers, or to other girls who might in turn tell their mothers, who might help. In the case of Motti Elon I can't see how a seventeen year old male didn't just push Elon off when he kissed him.
in todays Society where we live between animals there is no questions asked it is the Job of us parents to speak to our yiddshe children on a day to day Basis and see how they are steiging not only friday night after the fish
Motti Elon is a Rosh Yeshiva who kissed a 17 year old boy in his office in the yeshivah. That's not the same as a robber who may have a gun or knife. For Elon it was a lapse and he would likely have thanked the 17 year old student for stopping him.
Over the past many weeks, it seems that the online and print media have carried numerous stories of children who were sexually abused and people who knew and didn’t report the incidents. Excuses for not reporting ranged from a person not wanting to get involved, to the (insane!) reason of the potential damage to a chance for a shiduch (marriage match) for a member of the family of the victim or the offender.
Every time an offense is known about and goes unreported, there are terrible ramifications: The victim is once again victimized by NOT having been protected; the abuser is “free” to molest again; the abuser will (statistically) abuse others beyond their “current” victim; the abused potentially grows up to abuse others.
So, let’s set the record straight. We are guided by the Shulchan Aruch–the Code of Jewish Law. If one opens the Shulchan Aruch and looks at Choshen Mishpat 388, it becomes abundantly clear what the responsibility is of one who knows about abuse that is being perpetrated. If one reads the commentators (both the Sha”ch and the Me’irat Enayim) on subsections 7 and 12– with the associated comments–one will see immediately what is required of us by Jewish LAW.
SPEAK UP…REPORT! DO NOT REMAIN SILENT!
Let’s just take one “excuse” for non-reporting and take it to its (il)logical conclusion. A child is being abused by an offender. An adult becomes aware of this abuse and approaches a family and tells them NOT to proceed with reporting it to the authorities. When questioned by the family as to “why not report?” they are told, “Your family will have problems getting a shiduch for his/her siblings.” Or, just as terrible–they are told that the family of the abuser will be embarrassed and have trouble finding a match for their kids.
What if instead of sexual abuse, the case was that someone was walking around with a baseball bat hitting young children over their heads. Would people be told in those cases not to report? Would they feel that it would be a source of an embarrassment to the family to report the offender ? Would they be concerned that the family of the victims would have trouble finding a shiduch. Of course not! No one would hesitate to stop THAT form of abuse.
And yet, when it comes to sexual abuse, people zip their lips, keep their mouths shut and make sure that victims and their families do the same. And more kids get hurt; and more kids lives are ruined and the cycle of abuse continues. All because someone was afraid that mentioning the words “sexual abuse” would ruin someone’s chance for a match.
What about the OPPOSITE thought? Would you want to make a match for your child with the child of someone who KNOWINGLY prevented an abuser from being reported?
People, it is time to wake up. These are innocent children being harmed. Silence in these cases is the DIRECT cause of the child continuing to be hurt. Silence is the DIRECT cause of other children being hurt.
To those who prefer to keep silent I say: While you are sitting there wringing your hands over a shiduch for YOUR child, know that ANOTHER person’s child is having his life ruined because of your silence.
I have seen even worse reasons for not reporting child abuse. When the 2-4 Amhurst Park Boys School was faced with allegations that Dr William Garner may have behaved immorally with young boys, the school was apparently afraid that publicity would damage its girls' school's application for state aid! When East Finchley Boys School had a Mr King who violently and criminally assaulted small boys, the school was apparently afraid of publicity damaging its campaign for state aid. The irony, of course, was that doing such things in a state school would lead to criminal prosecution.
I can't account for Amhurst Park, but the E. Finchley school could not report Mr K, as so many of the Rebbes were equally as violent, if not more so. Furthermore, K probably knew where many a skeleton were hidden, which would have been a sufficient threat to the school's governing body, and would deter them from making any official complaint.
Why don't you go to the police with a formal complaint? They need to hear first hand about this. If he did what you allege he did, it is a criminal offence (abuse). By making a formal statement they can take things forward.
Over 5 years ago, but I have heard from others that he has still been at it with other boys in the last 2 years. not for no reason was he kicked out of the yeshivah in israel. He is a very sick man, children must know to keep well away from him.
Excellent discusion. What surprises me with Weberman's victim and with Yehudis Goldsobel is that any girl above the age of 12 at the latest should be aware of Halachahs of Yichud and Negia. I also don't understand, perhaps because I'm a male, how could young girls be suffering abuse for years and not talk to their mothers, or to other girls who might in turn tell their mothers, who might help. In the case of Motti Elon I can't see how a seventeen year old male didn't just push Elon off when he kissed him.
ReplyDeletein todays Society where we live between animals there is no questions asked
Deleteit is the Job of us parents to speak to our yiddshe children on a day to day Basis and see how they are steiging not only friday night after the fish
Rabbi Moshe K
Otter nonsense it is like saying a victim of a rubbery why
Deletedidn't you just push away the rubber...
You have no clue what sexual abuse is.... the victims are ashamed to discuss it with anyone .... it takes them years to open up !!
Motti Elon is a Rosh Yeshiva who kissed a 17 year old boy in his office in the yeshivah. That's not the same as a robber who may have a gun or knife. For Elon it was a lapse and he would likely have thanked the 17 year old student for stopping him.
DeleteOver the past many weeks, it seems that the online and print media have carried numerous stories of children who were sexually abused and people who knew and didn’t report the incidents. Excuses for not reporting ranged from a person not wanting to get involved, to the (insane!) reason of the potential damage to a chance for a shiduch (marriage match) for a member of the family of the victim or the offender.
ReplyDeleteEvery time an offense is known about and goes unreported, there are terrible ramifications: The victim is once again victimized by NOT having been protected; the abuser is “free” to molest again; the abuser will (statistically) abuse others beyond their “current” victim; the abused potentially grows up to abuse others.
So, let’s set the record straight. We are guided by the Shulchan Aruch–the Code of Jewish Law. If one opens the Shulchan Aruch and looks at Choshen Mishpat 388, it becomes abundantly clear what the responsibility is of one who knows about abuse that is being perpetrated. If one reads the commentators (both the Sha”ch and the Me’irat Enayim) on subsections 7 and 12– with the associated comments–one will see immediately what is required of us by Jewish LAW.
SPEAK UP…REPORT! DO NOT REMAIN SILENT!
Let’s just take one “excuse” for non-reporting and take it to its (il)logical conclusion. A child is being abused by an offender. An adult becomes aware of this abuse and approaches a family and tells them NOT to proceed with reporting it to the authorities. When questioned by the family as to “why not report?” they are told, “Your family will have problems getting a shiduch for his/her siblings.” Or, just as terrible–they are told that the family of the abuser will be embarrassed and have trouble finding a match for their kids.
What if instead of sexual abuse, the case was that someone was walking around with a baseball bat hitting young children over their heads. Would people be told in those cases not to report? Would they feel that it would be a source of an embarrassment to the family to report the offender ? Would they be concerned that the family of the victims would have trouble finding a shiduch. Of course not! No one would hesitate to stop THAT form of abuse.
And yet, when it comes to sexual abuse, people zip their lips, keep their mouths shut and make sure that victims and their families do the same. And more kids get hurt; and more kids lives are ruined and the cycle of abuse continues. All because someone was afraid that mentioning the words “sexual abuse” would ruin someone’s chance for a match.
What about the OPPOSITE thought? Would you want to make a match for your child with the child of someone who KNOWINGLY prevented an abuser from being reported?
People, it is time to wake up. These are innocent children being harmed. Silence in these cases is the DIRECT cause of the child continuing to be hurt. Silence is the DIRECT cause of other children being hurt.
To those who prefer to keep silent I say: While you are sitting there wringing your hands over a shiduch for YOUR child, know that ANOTHER person’s child is having his life ruined because of your silence.
I have seen even worse reasons for not reporting child abuse. When the 2-4 Amhurst Park Boys School was faced with allegations that Dr William Garner may have behaved immorally with young boys, the school was apparently afraid that publicity would damage its girls' school's application for state aid! When East Finchley Boys School had a Mr King who violently and criminally assaulted small boys, the school was apparently afraid of publicity damaging its campaign for state aid. The irony, of course, was that doing such things in a state school would lead to criminal prosecution.
DeleteI can't account for Amhurst Park, but the E. Finchley school could not report Mr K, as so many of the Rebbes were equally as violent, if not more so. Furthermore, K probably knew where many a skeleton were hidden, which would have been a sufficient threat to the school's governing body, and would deter them from making any official complaint.
DeleteI was wondering how long back reb chunez cctv can go back? As I myself have seen mr y...... touching a boy by his shmekel.
ReplyDeleteWhy don't you go to the police with a formal complaint? They need to hear first hand about this. If he did what you allege he did, it is a criminal offence (abuse). By making a formal statement they can take things forward.
DeleteHow long ago did this take place?
DeleteOver 5 years ago, but I have heard from others that he has still been at it with other boys in the last 2 years.
ReplyDeletenot for no reason was he kicked out of the yeshivah in israel. He is a very sick man, children must know to keep well away from him.
Again, comments about Mr Y, people should know, I've seen this, that and the other.
DeleteI don't know, so I can't act. You, the ones who claim to have first hand knowledge, why have you not come forth and reported him to the police?
Your silence makes you either complicit to any wrongdoing, or a liar who is publishing fairy tales to pump up your ego.
Either way, stop writing and, if you genuinely know something, report it!!!!!